Subject: comparatives

summary : intensification of the comparative i had in may on the list ( 8 . 758 ) a query on the intensification of comparative forms in different languages . here comes the summary related to the query ( i am sorry about the slight delay ! ) . as i noted earlier , my better linguistic competence limits to germanic languages plus finnish where in all the comparative ( of adjective , adverb , quantitative pronoun ) is typically intensified with an adverb denoting some form of totality : 1 . a . the train went faster . b . the train went ever faster . ( also : all the faster ) 2 . a . der zug fuhr schneller . b . der zug fuhr immer schneller . 3 . a . ta ' get gick fortare . b . ta ' get gick allt fortare . 4 . a . juna meni lujempaa . b . juna meni yha " lujempaa . ( also : aina lujempaa ) the intensifiers , e . g . ever in english , are in all these cases some kind of universal quantifiers , the content being approximately ' always ' or ' all the way ' ( see e . g . vendler ) . since the pattern shows some regularity , i was curious to gather information about functionally corresponding expressions in other languages . indeed , i did receive some further parallel examples , and moreover , there was some discussion about the appropriateness of the english example i had in the query ( 1b above ) . many thanks to the people who responded : ewb2 @ cornell . edu ( e . wayles browne ) larry horn < lhorn @ yalevm . ycc . yale . edu > ton van der wouden < vdwouden @ let . rug . nl > allan wechsler < awechsle @ bbn . com > knud lambrecht < lambrec @ uts . cc . utexas . edu > adiego lajara < adiego @ lingua . fil . ub . es > asya pereltsvaig < asya @ mail . netvision . net . il > " j . l . sancho , instituto de lexicografia " < sancho @ crea . rae . es > waruno mahdi < mahdi @ fhi-berlin . mpg . de > bark @ compunet . net ( gerald a . barker md ) philip grew < pgrew @ compuserve . com > as always , my wordings were a bit too implicit in the beginning . there are , of course , several ways of intensifying ( or modifying ) the comparative . a very normal form would be intensification of the degree , e . g . 5 . he is much faster than the rest of the guys . two individuals possessing a quality may also be compared with each other and one of the qaulities intensified in relation to the other : 6 . jack is fast but bob is even faster . perhaps it was my swedish perspective that led to the too general and implicit use of the label ' comparative intensifier ' . it seems , namely , that swedish has in allt ( see 3 above ) an adverb that may be used as an intensifier only with the comparative ( other adverbs may also be used but this is a kind of a prototype , as one can understand on the basis of wessen 's grammar , for instance ) , whereas the general intensifier mycket ( ' much ' , ' very ' ) may be used both with the positive and the comparative ( type 5 then ) . the distribution is not perhaps as strict in all languages and with all expressions . as regards , for example , finnish yha " , it may be used in other contexts too , but it seems that it has a more specialized ( grammaticized ? ) intensifying function when modifying a comparative , e . g . 7 . a . jaana on yha " kaunis . time adv . ' jane is still beautiful ' b . jaanasta tulee yha " kauniimpi . intensifer ' jane becomes ever more beautiful ' but this shows only that intensifiers that merely relate to the comparative do have a temporal implication . as a consequence , it seems that the comparative expresses a dynamic quality ( or degree ) that is opposed to the more stable positions of the positive and the superlative degrees ; the comparative represents a step in one direction but not to a definite point on a scale . the temporal intensifiers of the comparative focus on this implication of dynamism which , in turn , is often associated with successive development , change or process ( cf . the dynamism of verbs ) . moreover , the succession is signalled to be constant and ever-present - - and here we find the motivation of the universal quantifiers ( literally ever ) typically used with the comprative . we might want to look at some examples provided by the respondents ( the names of which are given in appropriate language sections below ) : * * * * * - - dutch : 8 . a . de trein ging sneller b . de trein ging alsmaar sneller c . de trein ging steeds sneller * steeds * and * alsmaar * ( also written as * almaar * ) are universal temporal quantifiers ( over a restricted domain - * altijd * is more unrestrictive ) . ton van der wouden - - - spanish : 9 . el tren iba cada vez ma 's ra ' pido " cada vez " , lit . " each time " catalan : 10 . el tren anava cada vegada / cada cop me 's ra ` pid " cada vegada , cada cop " , lit . " each time " nb : a ' , e ' etc . : vowels with acute accent ; a ` , o ` = vowels with grave accent . ignasi - xavier adiego - - - - italian : 11 . il treno andava sempre piu veloce . what i suspect will interest you here is that 's tandard ' italian ( like most other romance dialects , as i assume you will be told by readers expert in those ) uses the word that translates " always " ( sempre ) as the comparative intensifier you asked about . philip grew - - - russian : 12 . poezd exal bystree . train went faster [ more felicitous if the individual compared to is explicit as in 13 . ] 13 . poezd exal bystree chem mashina train went faster than car 14 . poezd exal vse bystree . train went all faster ' the train went ever faster ' asya pereltsvaig - - - croatian : 15 . a . vlak je is " ao brz " e . train aux went faster - adverb b . vlak je is " ao sve brz " e ( i brz " e ) . serbian : 16 . a . voz je is " ao brz " e . b . voz je is " ao sve brz " e ( i brz " e ) . s " , z " = letters with hac " ek on top . sve ' all ' neuter singular nom . / acc . wayles browne - - - in indonesian , the situation is a bit different , compare : 17 . a . kere ' taapi berjalan lebih cepat train | go - stat | mod | fast " the train goes / went faster " ( i . e . it went faster than the car , horse , other train ) b . kere ' taapi berjalan makin cepat train | go - stat | mod | fast " the train goes / went ever faster " ( i . e . it went constantly faster than it itself did in the preceding moment ( s ) ) where : e ' is &eacute ; ( pronounced like french &egrave ; , ipa epsilon ; ) e is pronounced like french e , ipa @ [ upside-down " e " ] ) c is pronounced like english ch , italian ci stat = stative ( expresses verbal " action " as state of being ) mod = modifier goes / went - there is no category of tense in indonesian , and time of " action " is expressed circumstantially , by adverbs , circumstantial phrases , etc . , also of course by context etc . so , in indonesian we do not intesify the comparative degree of comparison , but have a distinct accelerative " degree of comparison " . the complete paradigm is : comparative : _ lebih cepat _ " faster " accelerative : _ makin cepat _ " ever faster " intensive : _ sangat cepat _ " very fast " superlative : _ paling cepat _ " ( the ) fastest " excessive : _ terlalu cepat _ " too fast " insufficient : _ kurang cepat _ " not fast enough " negative : _ tidak cepat _ " not fast " strictly speaking , of course , this should probably not be seen as the set of forms of degrees of comparison , but a set of adjectival modifiers in combination with an adjective . waruno mahdi * * * * the above cases confirm the pattern that comparative forms tend to be intensified with a universal quatifier if its dynamic implications are to be amplified . the term ' accelerative ' in context of indonesian is illustrative - - although not totally accurate : it is also the only adjectival modification category that is associated with the comparative in the translation ( apart from comparative ' proper ' ) . one could think that the discussed expressions represent a " special case " of comparison , since there is not usually any explicit reference point in the expressions of the ' ever faster ' type ( i . e . a than - complement ) . that is why browne terms the use " free comparative " . on the other hand , there is nothing unusual in the use of this comparative ; it seems to be an application of the temporal comparative as in , for instance : 18 . jack has become faster than before . koenig suggests instead the term " cumulative comparative " , since the development is related to the temporal and the reference is often clearly enough understood in the context ( the term could be better for the indonesian ' accelerative ' too ) : 19 . jack has become ever faster . could in principle be a thinkable notional parallel to 18 ( cf . also 17b above ) . now , 19 ( and 1b for that matter ) may be a bit odd for english speakers , having seen the reactions on ever in my original query . ever is as an intensifier considered to be " stilted , literary , old-fashioned , high-style " , regarded as inference from german immer , or by americans labeled as " british " . instead , most speakers prefer a semantically corresponding expression consisting of conjoined syntactic reduplication : 20 . jack has become / becomes faster and faster . dictionaries and grammars of english also note this construction with the comparative ( zandvoort gives it even a name , " comparative of gradation " ) , so the expressive pattern can be regarded as quite established in english . it is not unique , though . most european languages allow the pattern comp + and + comp at least in informal register , and , i may reveal it now , these kinds of expressions are the object of study in my research on syntactic reduplication in swedish . the principally interesting thing is that languages seem to have different preferences as regards different intensifying patterns . english is perhaps most liberal in rather freely allowing conjoined repetition of type 20 , whereas koenig points out that german prefers expressions with an intensifier ( immer ) . the data i have surveyed seem to suggest that swedish is somewhere in between these two . the pattern comp + and + comp is theoretically interesting in that it expresses the same content as ever by iconicity . repetition stands for iteration and continuity ( ever , allt , sempre , yha " , cada vez ) , coordination enhances the meaning , since it implies with repetition non-simultaneity and asymmetry . even more intriguing is that some linguists ( e . g . koenig , lang ) draw a parallel between coordination and universal quantification . so we have a full circle here . as a final remark , i would like to remind that structures of the kind x + and + x are not limited to the comparative . it is quite usual to hear the use of this pattern with , for instance , verbs in colloquial speech : 21 . jack ran and ran . however , the use has not for some reason become as widely established with verbs . perhaps there is a larger resource of aspectual verbal and adverbial modifiers for verbs than the comparative , and , thus , less need for the somehow ' naive ' iterative pattern . the last assesment does not come out of the blue , but it is traditionally stated that different uses of repetitions are typical of , not only the language of poetry , but also among women and children or in texts designed for children , such as fairy tales ( note : this is merely a quote - - i would not put it in this way ! ) . what does this amount to ? reasonably , repetition is favored in discourse types where ( inter - ) personal involvement has an important role . further comments on the topic are , of course , welcome . the above summary is written in a relative haste , so i apologize for any shortcomings or misunderstandings ! the end of this message contains a list of works referred to . thank you for your interest and have a nice summer ! ( which has been real warm and sunny up here . . . ) jan k . lindstrom scandinavian languages and literature university of helsinki finland references : browne , wayles . 1964 . on adjectival comparisons and reduplication in english . unpublished manuscript . koenig , ekkehard . 1971 . kumulative komparative . in : beitraege zur generativen grammatik . schriften zur linguistik 3 . pp . 100-111 . lang , ewald . 1984 . the semantics of coordination . john benjamins , amsterdam . vendler , zeno . 1967 . each and every and all . in : linguistics in philosophy . cornell university press , ithaca , london . wessen , elias . 1970 . vaart svenska spraak . almqvist & wiksell , stockholm . zandvoort , r . w . 1975 ( 1962 ) . a handbook of english grammar . 7th ed . longman , london .
